Introducing Namespaces

General Discussion
#111

Well, nothing is forever but i disagree with your statement. What would be a good expiry period? 1Year? 5? 10? Every month? Does your real name expire (only if you die and what does expiry mean in this case)? Especially if you compare it to the real world I see much more grayscales between expired(and removed) and not expired.

@patmast3r: Hmm, for me these are no good reasons - XEM are also lost with lost keys and nobody cares. Claiming of common namespaces will happen anyway! And you say you can save some space by pruning, other say: don’t worry even if expired your old data is still in the chain and save…

Maybe it’s just me but I see no real reason why namespaces should expire at all. Single asset expiry, ok, this could be up for a discussion, but the whole namespace? At least make the timeframe for namespace expiry variable - something like: buying a namespace for “x” blocks in the future will cost “y” XEM. F.ex.: A namespace for 200000 blocks in the future will cost you 200000 * 0.01XEM = 2000XEM fees, 400000 blocks cost you 4000XEM and so on. Something like this - gives you the chance to prepay and reserve for a longer time if wanted - no need to renew in a fixed period.

Everybody is focusing on assets. Aren’t you thinking about use cases for namespaces beyond assets? Focusing on namespaces just to issue assets limits the huge potential imo.

Address book, alias, voting, reputation and so much more could be realized on top of namespaces.

#112

I said you can potentially save some space. Obviously this is not implemented right now.

#113

namespace could be easy go as unique digital ID of a person
reputation system could be in place to filter out fake IDs

the absolute opposite of all that anonymous crap going on everywhere

in fact we are white vest people we have nothing to hide

for me its much more valuable to be able prove who i am and what reputation i have than some anonymous feature stuff

namespace would be ideal for that

just one more of the million ways to take advantage of the potential a proper setup namespace could give to people

1 Like
#114

It took me some time to fully read this thread. Very interesting arguments been made. I am not even sure which point to reply to. I would just list my thoughts:

1- Fees should be directed to the NEM NODE REWARD account. And when DEV funds starts to run low, fees should by then automatically redirected to fund the DEV account(s).
2- Namespaces should totally disappear after expiration. However, that should happen gradually not just simply after 1 month. I would say for every year a namespace is being subscribed/registered the allowed time frame after expiration should be extended as of 1 month per every registered year:
- 1 year registration -> 1 month limit after expiration.
- 2 years registration -> 2 months limit after expiration.
- 12 years registration -> 1 year limit for renewal after expiration.
3- When a namespace expires it should first get downgraded to an orphan sub-namesapce before it totally get distorted. The time a namespace would stay in the downgraded orphan namespace should be 3 times the time it has spent waiting for renewal:
- 1 Year registration -> 1 month renewal limit -> 3 months in orphan namespace.
- 12 years registration -> 1 year renewal limit -> 3 years in orphan namespace.

#115

The anons of the internet and their commerce is a very very small fraction of the known and identified commerce users. This isn’t to say that we should put everyone’s information on the blockchain. I just think there should be an option. A way for anon people to access anon services and protect their privacy, and a way for known users to access transparent systems where information isn’t anon.

2 Likes
#116

Could something as bitbtc on bitshares be developed on nem namespaces? If yes, what would expiry of the namespace mean? It would be catastrophic no?

1 Like
#117

I guess so, bitbtc is just a derivate, so I don’t know why it should not be possible.
And for that example: Well, “Bitshares” wont let the namespace expire I guess…

#118

Then I would urge to not have mandatory expiration, as it would prevent the development of some stuff like bitbtc equivalents.

Maybe there could be :

  • non expiring namespaces under a generic parent namespace like perm.bitbtc
  • expiring but renewable by anyone. Remember someone renewed hotmail.com when ms had forgotten to do it?
  • expiring and renewable only by owner. Not sure this one is needed…
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#119

renewable by anyone is a interesting solution for the problem

so if the namespace contains stuff of value even if creator disapeared still people able renow the namespace

its also imported u allow creation of locked assets

which mean they can be traded and all but noone not even the creator can create more

#120

@1: Then perm would need to be significantly more expensive to buy imho.
@2: https://finance.yahoo.com/news/guy-bought-google-com-google-230510405.html
That would be a major crapfest imho unless the owning account is somehow part of the name of the namespace. If someone can just come and renew someone elses namespace and then overtake the trust that potentially comes with it that’s a major flaw imho.
@3: I think that’s the way it is planned right now. At least that’s how I understood it.

#121

NEM Node Rewards are closer to being finished and Namespaces and Mosaics are going live on the Testnet now.

Which brings me to the old question, “where does the namespace fee go?”. It seems to be the general consensus is that it should go into the Node Rewards program and I agree with that but then at some point possibly change to Development Funds. But when?

I am going to suggest that namespace fees go to the Node Rewards until V1 and then post V1 to the Dev Funds. The reason why is the funds right now have a good amount of XEM in them, but that is expected to be mostly gone at V1 with very little left for dev funds. V1 will also need a hard fork anyway I am guessing, so I think that is the time to fork in the change from Node Rewards to Dev Funds. Also by that time hopefully Node Rewards will have found other additional ways to gain sustainable funding.

#122

dont know if I missed this, but is there a summary of all the fees involved by amount for the actions taken on Mosaics and Namespaces?

#123

root namespace right now is 50,000 XEM, sub namespace is 5000 XEM, and creating a mosaic is 108 XEM.

the 50,000 XEM target was set with about a $5 a year price in mind. As the marketcap of NEM rises, this will need to be lowered.

1 Like
#124

Ah. And right now to create a mosaic is 108

#125

Creating a mosaic definition is 50_000 XEM. Changing the supply is 108 XEM.

1 Like
#126

How can I undo only the created namespace? By chance I created it and I do not need it.

#127

You cannot undo the creation of a namespace, it is a transaction that creates it and it will sty in the blockchain forever (though the namespace will die after a year).

#128

I really wanted to get ready to start harvesting and accidentally climbed into the namespace. Help 5000 xem for me is very big money (

http://chain.nem.ninja/#/namespace/b17ab9eee256afacc41537bc1d5df9ad1a49187b34162ce15d680574c4ba9fc0

#129

Sorry, this is blockchain technology, it can’t be undone :slight_frown:

#131

You can sell it to someone perhaps, try asking if anyone needs it.