what are peoples thoughts on AT being integrated into nem? is this something that can be done or do the devs have their own plans for doing this? iv followed it for a long time in nxt but it seems now they want to integrate AT into a few more coins.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=822100.0
what are peoples thoughts on AT being integrated into nem? is this something that can be done or do the devs have their own plans for doing this? iv followed it for a long time in nxt but it seems now they want to integrate AT into a few more coins.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=822100.0
AT is pretty much something i requested some time back in the original NEM BTT thread. Personally, i think it's an essential component to make NEM (or any crypto, for this matter) a viable alternative for average joe looking to break away from FIAT.
what are peoples thoughts on AT being integrated into nem? is this something that can be done or do the devs have their own plans for doing this? iv followed it for a long time in nxt but it seems now they want to integrate AT into a few more coins.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=822100.0
When NIS will be open sourced we can make a bounty for integrating it. So this will not distract core developers from existing roadmap.
I would like the same happen for SuperNet client.
Very cool.
I'm assuming you all saw Ciyam's post that he is putting AT in the NXT test net now.
This will be very important to implement in NEM, I don't think we have a better solution for turing completeness & cross blockchain transactions. If we provide an easy to use GUI for AT we would be set.
This will be very important to implement in NEM, I don't think we have a better solution for turing completeness & cross blockchain transactions. If we provide an easy to use GUI for AT we would be set.
perhaps we should get in contact with CIYAM?
devs - thoughts?
This will be very important to implement in NEM, I don't think we have a better solution for turing completeness & cross blockchain transactions. If we provide an easy to use GUI for AT we would be set.
perhaps we should get in contact with CIYAM?
devs - thoughts?
I hope we can make progress towards implementing this feature in NEM. Turing Completeness holds so many possibilities. I would like to hear the devs on this matter as well Kodtycoon.
I've been following Ethereum and NXT AT stuff for a while, and the main problem of a turing complete language on top of the blockchain is malicious users with enough "cash" to burn. Ethereum uses gas to fire their code but that doesn't stop anybody with enough will and gas to disrupt the network and/or create malicious scripts that cannot be deleted by anyone and might as well live forever.
"What is the problem if the malicious user want to do that? it's their money and problem" you may say, but no, the problem is that the consensus need to perpetuate the created smart contracts and keep validating them just like transactions, and that is computationally expensive, even a POS only token would suffer from this. That's is easily the biggest drawback of having an "infinite possibility language" running on a decentralized blockchain.
Ethereum goes even far and allow you to reach outside services and even reference other contracts. Of course, their PoCs are working and, in 'alpha stage' everything is lighter, only a few people can create smart contracts and oracles on top of ethereum right now. But when widespread use comes, there will be problem.
It's not like the Internet itself, that anyone can code a trojan, a malicious banking script and put up a unaware host, you will be actually housing executable code that lives as long there isn't a hard fork to fix this. How many times it will be necessary?
I'm all in for functionality on top of the blockchain, but I think things should go in parallel. Like transactions, messages, aliases, keep on the main blockchain, and another blockchain is entirely dedicated to executing code, that most people could have this turned off by default, and only a few nodes would choose whether enable it and be rewarded by it. This parallel blockchain could then watch changes in the main block chain, and do it's magic.
Good insight pocesar!
Now we have to understand if it possible to integrate AT as an optional component.
Turing Completeness holds so many possibilities.
Such as? Most people don't really understand what "turing complete" means and just throw it around as a buzz word.
I've been following Ethereum and NXT AT stuff for a while, and the main problem of a turing complete language on top of the blockchain is malicious users with enough "cash" to burn. Ethereum uses gas to fire their code but that doesn't stop anybody with enough will and gas to disrupt the network and/or create malicious scripts that cannot be deleted by anyone and might as well live forever.
"What is the problem if the malicious user want to do that? it's their money and problem" you may say, but no, the problem is that the consensus need to perpetuate the created smart contracts and keep validating them just like transactions, and that is computationally expensive, even a POS only token would suffer from this. That's is easily the biggest drawback of having an "infinite possibility language" running on a decentralized blockchain.
Ethereum goes even far and allow you to reach outside services and even reference other contracts. Of course, their PoCs are working and, in 'alpha stage' everything is lighter, only a few people can create smart contracts and oracles on top of ethereum right now. But when widespread use comes, there will be problem.
It's not like the Internet itself, that anyone can code a trojan, a malicious banking script and put up a unaware host, you will be actually housing executable code that lives as long there isn't a hard fork to fix this. How many times it will be necessary?
I'm all in for functionality on top of the blockchain, but I think things should go in parallel. Like transactions, messages, aliases, keep on the main blockchain, and another blockchain is entirely dedicated to executing code, that most people could have this turned off by default, and only a few nodes would choose whether enable it and be rewarded by it. This parallel blockchain could then watch changes in the main block chain, and do it's magic.
A good summary of the dangers of including code in the blockchain. I have the same feeling and have not seen any cases where a turing complete blockchain language is advantageous or even desirable.
I do hope that we will have another parallel chain by the end of V1, but we'll see what happens ;).
I've been following Ethereum and NXT AT stuff for a while, and the main problem of a turing complete language on top of the blockchain is malicious users with enough "cash" to burn. Ethereum uses gas to fire their code but that doesn't stop anybody with enough will and gas to disrupt the network and/or create malicious scripts that cannot be deleted by anyone and might as well live forever.
"What is the problem if the malicious user want to do that? it's their money and problem" you may say, but no, the problem is that the consensus need to perpetuate the created smart contracts and keep validating them just like transactions, and that is computationally expensive, even a POS only token would suffer from this. That's is easily the biggest drawback of having an "infinite possibility language" running on a decentralized blockchain.
Ethereum goes even far and allow you to reach outside services and even reference other contracts. Of course, their PoCs are working and, in 'alpha stage' everything is lighter, only a few people can create smart contracts and oracles on top of ethereum right now. But when widespread use comes, there will be problem.
It's not like the Internet itself, that anyone can code a trojan, a malicious banking script and put up a unaware host, you will be actually housing executable code that lives as long there isn't a hard fork to fix this. How many times it will be necessary?
I'm all in for functionality on top of the blockchain, but I think things should go in parallel. Like transactions, messages, aliases, keep on the main blockchain, and another blockchain is entirely dedicated to executing code, that most people could have this turned off by default, and only a few nodes would choose whether enable it and be rewarded by it. This parallel blockchain could then watch changes in the main block chain, and do it's magic.
A good summary of the dangers of including code in the blockchain. I have the same feeling and have not seen any cases where a turing complete blockchain language is advantageous or even desirable.
I do hope that we will have another parallel chain by the end of V1, but we'll see what happens ;).
Wait… What? Parallel chains by end of V1? Havent pretty much all major crypto contenders been trying to do PC's since forever with out success? You think you can pull it off?
Wait.. What? Parallel chains by end of V1? Havent pretty much all major crypto contenders been trying to do PC's since forever with out success? You think you can pull it off?
I think emunie has a parallel chain already.
Wait.. What? Parallel chains by end of V1? Havent pretty much all major crypto contenders been trying to do PC's since forever with out success? You think you can pull it off?
I think emunie has a parallel chain already.
Wow, that is pretty big news.
In other news. CIYAM has left NXT and will "probably" release AT on Qora. Yes, that is right AT to Qora.
The condition is if they meet his bounty and he gets paid enough upfront.
His work is all open-source and NXT still has a copy of it and so they will be implementing it too.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=522102.msg9204444#msg9204444
In other news. CIYAM has left NXT and will "probably" release AT on Qora. Yes, that is right AT to Qora.
The condition is if they meet his bounty and he gets paid enough upfront.
His work is all open-source and NXT still has a copy of it and so they will be implementing it too.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=522102.msg9204444#msg9204444
That is pretty big news!
In other news. CIYAM has left NXT and will "probably" release AT on Qora. Yes, that is right AT to Qora.
The condition is if they meet his bounty and he gets paid enough upfront.
His work is all open-source and NXT still has a copy of it and so they will be implementing it too.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=522102.msg9204444#msg9204444
That is pretty big news!
Unless I have missed out something, I am not sure about its relevance in NEM as we have our business rules too.
Crypto coin exchange? What for when in the long term we do not also see much relevance in the exchange between a Panda and a dog coin for example.
I'd rather we spend more time by concentrating on the real use of our NEM platform and ecosystem for the real purpose.
On the whole, I see it as a programming challenge that will satisfy a few instead of the 7 billion people.
So it is possible to implementing it to NEM too?
So it is possible to implementing it to NEM too?
NEM is implementing Business Rules. That is some sort of a smart contract. It is part of V1.